Edwards tell Toseland to put up or shut it

[Dr freedom]

:lmao: http://www.asphaltandrubber.com/racing/trouble-yamahas-camp/

Edwards has lost his crew chief, Gary Reinders, who has jumped to be the chief for Toseland.. it seems Edwards is a tad upset & said a code of ethic's in the paddock has been broken.
Here is the article.

More Trouble in Yamaha’s Camp (http://www.asphaltandrubber.com/racing/trouble-yamahas-camp/)

Even more trouble is brewing in Yamaha camp. First Jorge Lorenzo tossed some grenades over the wall in his garage at Valentino Rossi, and now James Toseland has gone off and stolen Colin Edwards’ crew chief. Hold on it’s going to be bumpy ride, read more after the jump.
Gary Reinders, who was Edward’s crew chief, has now switched over to the Toseland side of the Garage for the 2009 season.
According to Toseland the switch is necessary to ensure his place in MotoGP, and the expert skills of Reinders should be allocated to him, and not Colin, who’s time in MotoGP is likely coming to an end soon:

“The simple fact is there was a communication problem between Guy [Coulon] and myself. There was a lack of understanding between my feedback and how it translated into the bike. I’m not criticising anybody. This is solely to get an understanding so we can work in a more productive way…Gary pointed out that he would like to work with me. It is not a secret that it could be Colin’s last year in 2009, and Gary also wants a longer career in MotoGP, as I do. I can’t have the inconsistency next year, because I don’t want it to be my last year, either.”
Edwards does not share the same sentiment as Toseland, and says that a code of ethics has been breach in the paddock.

“I think he has crossed the line. The thought of taking my teammate’s crew chief would never have crossed my mind, but I guess I’ve got a different code of ethics than what James has and that’s probably the part that has pissed me off the most. I won’t lose any sleep over not talking to James.”
Edwards goes on to say that Toseland needs to put up or shut-up: “He’s got the best crew chief he believes he can have, so now he’s got to go out and prove it and stop blaming everything else,” Edwards said. “His only option now is to win races. He’s got no excuses; now I don’t feel any need to show any respect towards both of them, really.”
Either completely clueless, or running a good PR machine, Herve Poncharal, the Tech 3 team manager, stated just a week ago in an interview with MotoGP.com (http://www.motogp.com/en/news/2008/Poncharal+looking+forward+to+2009+challenge):

“I think both Colin and James are really happy with the change of crew chiefs. It is good to have stability but it is always good to have something new and not to fall asleep. In Valencia after the race we had a meeting with Colin, his new crew chief and the team that he will keep and then we did the same later with James and both of them seemed really fired up, really happy.”
With this many different stories going on, now we know where the trois in Tech 3 comes from

[Sprinter]

Always saw Toseland as a tosser

[Ed_GSXR]

Disagreed. If the crew chief wants to jump ship, that's up to him right?

I doubt very much that Toseland could simply 'steal' a member of another riders team without the consent of 1. Said individual and 2. The team management. In fact it sounds more like their idea than anyone elses.
We all know Colin's a good lad, but surely we've seen the best of him already. Toseland is however, up and coming. It makes sense to me that the team would prioritise him.

[Sprinter]

Doesnt disprove the popular "Toseland is a tosser" theory even so;)

[Cedric]

I agree. It must surely have been a joint decision between the Edwards' crew chief and Toseland. For this to occur, both involved must have seen more potential or greener grass in the partnership.

I wouldn't write Edwards off yet. I think he is entering the twilight of his career, maybe a couple of years left in the Premier class but I think this is is best opportunity to play a larger role in his team (as compared to Fiat Yamaha) and a larger say over the development of the Tech 3 Yamaha. I don't think anyone would have an easy time of it, being Rossi's teammate. I think he has yet to reach his full potential in this current team.

Toseland I see as a reasonably earnest guy, although he has upset a lot in the paddock with his aggressive (to the MotoGP incumbents) approach to racing. I wouldn't mind seeing a little more of what he's bringing to MotoGP, this year is too processional.. I wonder how it's going to affect the racing now that the single tyre rule is in force. Hopefully all the Michelin riders are going to have a look in this year..

[*Oggy*]

Why you say Toseland is a tosser ???? Are we talking about the same guy who seemed to have the legs over Bayliss ??

From what I've read hes a decent guy who isnt up himself at all ????

[zRoYz]

I wouldn't write Edwards off yet. I think he is entering the twilight of his career, maybe a couple of years left in the Premier class but I think this is is best opportunity to play a larger role in his team (as compared to Fiat Yamaha) and a larger say over the development of the Tech 3 Yamaha. I don't think anyone would have an easy time of it, being Rossi's teammate. I think he has yet to reach his full potential in this current team.


Edwards will never win a race just doesn't have that little something extra motogp winners need. He is past it & will be surprised if he can even get on the podium in 09. Don't get me wrong I think the guy is a great rider & one of my fav in the paddock because he doesn't talk himself up & seems very down to earth.

My guess is your going to only see the Duc, Honda, Yamaha factory team rides on the podium all year.

[BART]

This is just a business decision and should not be taken personally by anyone.

People make these types of decisions every day that benefit themselves and their families.

My motto is always look after yourself and your family as they come first.

[Birdman45]

Maybe wanna see what Col's ol' man said on the subject, Seems JT is in fact a tosser. LOL Col has had his ups and downs, and if anyone noticed, when he was Rossi's team mate, he all of a sudden went well when Rossi was out with that injury etc? It ain't a coincidence and his problem has been he is always no2 rider, at least in GP. Tyres have played way too big a role in GP for too long. Next year is gonna sort some men from some boys, and from what I have seen , JT is still a boy. Anyway, here is the "real deal" on what went on etc from Colin Snr:

"Let me see if I can give you all the real story here, between all the BS that I have read on the ninjaswhathisname/MCN thread I just had to say something.

It seems that JT was talking to Gary one day and Gary gave him a few tips and he tried them and they worked. After that JT made his mind up that he was going to get Gary as his crew chief for 09 and win races. JT conspired with Gary to make sure that he would go with him, after promises that if he had the right crew chief he was Yamaha's future and Gary would have a long future with him and they could win races. As Colin is on the back side of his career JT convinced Gary to go with him and I can see Gary's point there and he was just looking out for himself but he didn't think about Colin's reaction as a friend. After that was settled, JT and his manager called a meeting with the Japanese Yamaha heads and told them that he was Yamahas future both in MotoGP and the music side and gave them an ultimatum that if he didn't get Gary next year he was out of there or something to that effect. While this was going on it was just between JT and Gary and both Herve and Colin were kept out of this completely. The Japanese said if all the parties involved agreed with the change it would be ok with them. Well now the sticky part starts because Gary had to go to Colin and tell him that he has agreed to go with JT next year. Colin was completely blindsided as he thought that he had a real close friendship with Gary and for him to go behind his back with this was crushing. Gary started crying and carrying on that he didn't want to do it but he was just thinking about his future etc, etc as Colin only had a contract for 09 and an option for 2010. After that Colin was totally pissed that this had all happened behind his back but what choice did he have then ! He lost all respect for both Gary and James and really didn't have much choice about the matter and the original plan was that Gary was going to get another crew chief for Colin that had worked with Crivelle, because Guy didn't want any part of this conspiracy and stepped back. It wasn't until all the dust settled that Colin insisted on Guy for his crew chief so he wouldn't feel left out and Guy was happy with the deal as it seems there was too much tension in the JT camp for him anyway. JT even wanted Colin's computer and suspension guys too but that didn't happen. Around this time Herve caught wind of what was going on and he got pissed that he was left out of the loop on decisions in his own team and said the change wasn't going to happen and it was only after Colin convinced Herve that he was ok with it that Herve backed off and gave the deal his blessing but I think the shine between Herve, Gary and JT has dulled quite a bit. If they had used protocol and gone to Herve in the first place, it would have gone down the same way without the conspiracy and even tempers would have prevailed. Colin called me right after all this went down and he was really crushed, mainly because he thought he had a real friendship with Gary and JT and felt he was totally stabbed in the back and had lost a friend and all respect for "Wonder Boy". I am sure there were some choice words said and some juicy interviews but I think it is the best thing that ever happened as Colin rides his best pissed off or under pressure as he has proved in the past. As far as "ninjawhathisname" quote "Maybe if he'd kept up his early season form, and not sat back on his heels as soon as he knew that he had another contract, then HP might well have called it differently" it is quite evident that you need to have your facts straight before you put your foot in your mouth. And as far as the two talking again, I will let you all make up your own mind about that but I would imagine the relationship would be strained at the least. Colin was planning to retire next year but it was Yamaha that offered him the deal for the next two years and if they keep offering mill + contracts I think he will stay, so as far as "Colin sitting back on his heels as soon as he knew he had another contract" I will mention foot in the mouth again and quote "immature and silly" If you remember the fiasco in Germany and following races with Michelin, that had a little to do with Colin's poor second half of the year. From my point of view from listening to Colin about the tires, he just lost all confidence in Michelin after Germany.

Now James has his team right, get ready for next year as the JT / GR combination will be winning races.

I hope this puts a different light on the situation as this is the good oil.

Snr "

[Ed_GSXR]

And thus JT is a tosser because....?

[Kat00]

"Code of ethics" ......in racing at that level......yeah right...

JT was an under achiever last year for sure..... so Edwards has got a point there......Its put up or shut up in 2009....for both of them.

[Birdman45]

He should have talked To CE about it and the team as a whole instead of running around behind backs and causing shit. Pretty self explainatory I'd have thought. LOL

[Birdman45]

as for code of ethics, it depends on your team mate. Rossi loved CE as his team mate coz there was a heap of things he trusted CE with sorting out for them quicker than on their own. But say Boaggi and Rossi were team mates, then of course, what ethics? Haha Brookesy had the same deal with Hahms this year, started off well, and at PI agreed to show him some lines etc, put him on the front row even with a tow around on his qualifying lap, and come race day he duffs Josh up and makes it real hard for him, so, game over from then on in and every man for himself. I think there is a code depending on who your teamed with, and obviously there was with JT and CE, hence the fall out over this. JT's loss, coz Colin would give you the world if needed to, and you're on the right side of him.

[Cedric]

Maybe that's just my wishful thinking zRoYz.. I agree he's quite a likeable character in the paddock and I like the fact he speaks his mind and is not a mindless sponsor thanking drone like a certain Repsol Honda rider..

I still think he's got some podiums left in him - although having said that, he's not on his beloved Michelins anymore in which he played quite a development role.
Although he got some good results in 2005 with Gauloises Yamaha (4th?), I think this is his best chance since then (Aprilia Cube, Telefonica Movistar Honda and Rossi's teammate at Yamaha)

But hey, I could be wrong.. in fact I think it'll depend largely on his adaptation to Bridgestone rubber.

[Birdman45]

It ain't the adaption that is the problem. They are bike racers and fukn great ones at that, it took Rossi how long? The problem is getting the same tyres come race day as everyone else, that is why the Control tyres are gonna be great for GP, racing wise anyway. Yeah Colin did heaps of development work for Michelin but come race day the A tyres weren't always there for him. Come Monday testing, all tyres for eveyrone and he's top2 or 3 again. I agree this is his best bet yet now the tyres will be more even. Go Col I say.

[jasonbw]

That shouldnt be allowed, it's like match-fixing. What about the new one make tyre rule, will the same shit happen????

[Birdman45]

well, I don't wanna start a huge shit fight, but I know everyone thinks "well he was on Michelins and so was X Y and Z riders" but that is hardly the way it ever was. Hecne once Rossi couldn't get a good tyre out of them he went to the Stones to keep up. If he was the god everyone says, why couldn't he just beat Stoner on the best Michelins? He couldn't, so he changed. In saying that no way he used the same construction tyres as Stoner either, soft med or hard, big deal, that works for TV etc, but the actual structure of the tyres was way different, and it wasn't until they got that right he started spankin everyone again. So again, hopefully if Bridgestone and Gp work the same way Pirelli have with WSBK, it's gonna be freakin awesome year of racing in 09.

[Cedric]

I gotta say I don't really think going to a single tyre rule is what MotoGP is all about and I think it's detrimental to the blue-sky engineering principle that is central to prototype racing.

Having said that, I'm looking forward to the 2009 MotoGP season. I remember some woeful races of the 2008 season, Brno sticks out in my mind as one where Michelin weren't in the same league as Bridgestone, and Pedrosa had that spat. Single tyre rule will allow the better riders to be at the front irrespective of what tyres they used to run.

[Ed_GSXR]

Well I've never met JT, or CE or any other motogp rider but from what I've heard, Toseland is one of the nicest guys you could hope to meet. Is he not right to try and get the best team, for himself?
Be sure of one thing - the press are very quick to blow up reports of fallouts and rivalry in the paddock. These stories usually surface when there's bugger all interesting happening. Anyway, like you guys, I'm as always looking forward to the next season of Moto GP. Still miss the 990cc bikes though..

[Cedric]

Oh yeah, 990s were so much better than 800s. I liked the sliding, slipping style, especially the ex-superbike guys. Safety bikes.. yeah right..

[*Oggy*]

At the end of the day (if crew chief, Gary Reinders) is any good then he can dictate what he wants to do and (again) the better prospect rider will get more pulling power, so I guess Gary and Toseland both have an upper hand in the team dynamics.

I have always liked Edwards as a rider, but he is on his way down and Toseland is on his way up (or out) I guess.

[Birdman45]

maybe never sleep, and Colin and him got along great, Col's said James was a really nice guy, but that is why I spose Col thinks he should have come to the TEAM and sorted this out instead of going behind peoples (his) back. In the end it may turn out for the best and the actual swapping I don't think is the problem, it's the way James went about it. Tellin ya now, a nicer guy in the GP paddock than CE you'll never meet. He gets along with everyone, but as for the tyre rule, I agree to a point about the development of bikes etc, but on the flip side, how is a bike being developed to it's very limits when it's only function is to work with whatever tyres you're running, and the winners are those with the best tyres?? At least this way, the bikes will be on even footing in that regard (hopefully) and it is the BIKE that is being developed to its full potential etc.... yes to that tyre, but so is everyone elses. As for development of tyres, you do not need Moto gP for that, so who cares.

[gazujc]

Well what the heck, may as well throw my 2 cents worth into the picture but gioven a number of comments here they wont be to popular.

IMO, Edwards has had a decent opportunity to achieve within the MotoGP class and aside from a few podiums and one implosion at Assen has never looked like a race winner or championship contender at this level. Yet he maintains his ride whereas others have long been shifted to other classes or off into returements.

MotoGP is a business and as such Toseland took an opportunity that he felt was best for him, as did the engineer involved.

To say that Toseland underpeformed (weas it Kat00?) I feel is not correct as it was his first year in MotoGP and his first on many of the tracks. Yes he did not achieve the results of other rookies but still, IMO Toseland performed very well and out performed his more regarded and illustrious team-mate in may aspects.

All we are hearing is the Edwards version of events and of course they are very biased. Being quite honest, he comes across as a little child who just had a lolly taken from him and really he should just shut up, grow up and ocus on achieving something before he toddles off to retirement.

Many people seem to cut CE a lot of slack because he is seen to be a genuine nice guy, but he has achieved little in his time and with MotoGP being a business of course people will poach or leave for what they see as better opportunities. IMO, JT provides a better opportunity at this stage for longevity in the MotoGP field so why not go that way.

For Edwards to also be quoted as saying that it is now time for JT to 'put up or shut up' just raises the question of what has been Edwards excuse for these years. Why has he not performed better and/or achieved more across his MotoGP career?

Who is right and/or who is in the wrong doesn't matter as it is the nature of business and sport to perform backroom deals to get those that you feel you need around you. That was done here and personally I give full credit to Toseland for keeping quiet, maintaining his dignity and not lowering himself to the level of a spolit brat.





Garry

[Dr freedom]

Reality is though that Edwards nor Toseland pick the team .. the owners/mangement do that. They would ask Toseland how he gets along with this person, that person etc etc, but at the end of the day, the team management are the ones who would have askd the Chief to go over & he can only say yes or no.

I would say Toseland has got under Edwards nose a little & seeing as hes lost some crew to him, he is putting it simple, perform or fck up lol.

[Birdman45]

How on earth did Toseland out perform Edwards this year? Hahaha That is hilarious. As soon as Toseland had is arse kicked for jammin people left right and centre, he was where? Nowhere. Have a look at what you have asked though, about why Edwards is still where he is after your thoughts on not performing, and then look at it from a different view. The guys in the paddock know who is riding to the level of the bike and tyres...... the guys in the teams know how well the rider is setting up the bike, and going forward with what they are trying to do. If you wanna have a look at the rides he's had and what happend at those times, I'm glad to explain. But to say he hasn't done what was expected of him or acheived what he should have etc, is pretty narrow minded. But anyway.......... 09 should be way better either way, tyre rule, CE and JT pissed , Rossi playing mind games already, bring it on.

[gazujc]

How on earth did Toseland out perform Edwards this year? Hahaha That is hilarious. As soon as Toseland had is arse kicked for jammin people left right and centre, he was where? Nowhere. Have a look at what you have asked though, about why Edwards is still where he is after your thoughts on not performing, and then look at it from a different view. The guys in the paddock know who is riding to the level of the bike and tyres...... the guys in the teams know how well the rider is setting up the bike, and going forward with what they are trying to do. If you wanna have a look at the rides he's had and what happend at those times, I'm glad to explain. But to say he hasn't done what was expected of him or acheived what he should have etc, is pretty narrow minded. But anyway.......... 09 should be way better either way, tyre rule, CE and JT pissed , Rossi playing mind games already, bring it on.


Ok, you asked.

Please explain what CE has done that has met the requirements that determine whether or not he should be remaining in the main game.

Has he won races - NO.

How many podium places has he had in his years in MotoGP - ? (I am to lazy to check but expect around 6 - 8)

He has been #2 rider in the FIAT Yamaha team at a time when it had the best rider but he still struggled to macth the performance (who wouldn't).

He then went to Tech 3 (forced move) as the #1 rider and achieved very little.

Edwards was by self admission and reported to be the primary development rider for Michelin and as such I strongly doubt that he was low on the pecking order last year. Whilse I am happy to accept he was likely lower on that order than Pedrosa I strongly doubt that he was getting lesser quality tyres than Lorenzo (FIAT #2) or Dovisioso, both rookies who finished higher up the championship.

As for JT out performing him, I stand by that. JT was in his first year in MotoGP, on a bike unfamiliar, on tyres unfamiliar, on some circuits that were unfamiliar and with a team with whom he was unfamiliar yet he finished 39 points behind a man with 6 years experience. To me, that isn't to bad for a first timer and given the manner in which JT rode some races this year (ie. his battle with VR at PI) he showed that he can mix it and IMO provided a better return for Tech 3 in 2008. Thus, to me he outperformed Edwards.


Certainly there were some races where the Michelin were crap, but correct me if I am wrong, did not other Micheling riders finish higher?

Weren't some these rookies?

My point is simply that Edwards may well be a nice guy (from all accounts he is) but is this enough to keep him in GP and should it excuse failure/lack of results (CE is one of a few in that boat)?

Now, as a comparison, throughout the year CE finished in front of JT in 11 races to 7 (including 4xDNF's for JT and 2xDNF's for CE). Personally I would expect such a split in a first year where one rider is experienced and the second not so experienced (no valid comparison's elsewhere as no other rider came from WSBK to a two rider team).

Interestingly you say that JT fell off the ball somewhat after the criticism of his hard riding, yet he finished in front of Edwards in 5 of the last 9 races (Germany, Laguna Seca, Brno, San Marino and Phillip Island).

We obviously have differring opinions and mine is simply that CE has had an opportunity and done little with it (results wise) and as such (nice guy or not) my point is that the technician etc have likely seen a longer term better performing prospect in JT and gone that way. Time will tell if that was the right choice or not (I do not see JT winning championships nor races, but then the same applies to CE).







Garry

[Stu23]

Interesting comments

Now as a brit I think James did pretty well in his 1st year, apart from the Donnington err cock up !! The teams listen to their riders, if they agree then the team decides. I reckon the Tech 3 team last year was fantastic, what they achieved etc etc.
As for this year they want more, who is going to give this to them, good question huh. Personally I think Colin Edwards is a nice guy, but is a guy who can qualify really well, but not race really well, I think James Toseland qualify's crap mostly.....and races really really well. What the team needs to do is splice them into 1 rider :) hahaha

James can give them maybe 5 years in Gp, Colin is done after this year I would think, He has been great, but in cold reality, he didnt quite get there did he....Will James Toseland, who knows, we will have to wait and see, and if he doesnt then he wil get kicked out.....all this matey stuff doesnt really work in high pressure environments where your future in the team rests on your ability to beat your team mate.....

[Turtle]

How on earth did Toseland out perform Edwards this year? Hahaha That is hilarious. As soon as Toseland had is arse kicked for jammin people left right and centre, he was where? Nowhere. Have a look at what you have asked though, about why Edwards is still where he is after your thoughts on not performing, and then look at it from a different view. The guys in the paddock know who is riding to the level of the bike and tyres...... the guys in the teams know how well the rider is setting up the bike, and going forward with what they are trying to do. If you wanna have a look at the rides he's had and what happend at those times, I'm glad to explain. But to say he hasn't done what was expected of him or acheived what he should have etc, is pretty narrow minded. But anyway.......... 09 should be way better either way, tyre rule, CE and JT pissed , Rossi playing mind games already, bring it on.

Gotta agree with Birdman (the original Birdy) Edwards is a Legend........And all round Top Bloke !!:ayyy:

[Dr freedom]

Colin Edwards career:

2007: 9th - MotoGP Championship (Yamaha)
2006: 7th - MotoGP Championship (Yamaha)
2005: 4th - MotoGP Championship (Yamaha)
2004: 5th - MotoGP Championship (Honda)
2003: 13th - MotoGP Championship (Aprilia)
2002: 1st - World Superbike Championship (Honda)
2001: 2nd - World Superbike Championship (Honda)
2000: 1st - World Superbike Championship (Honda)
1999: 2nd - World Superbike Championship (Honda)
1998: 5th - World Superbike Championship (Honda)
1997: 12th - World Superbike Championship (Yamaha)
1996: 5th - World Superbike Championship (Yamaha)
1995: 11th - World Superbike Championship (Yamaha)
1994: 6th - AMA Superbike Championship (Yamaha)
1993: 6th - AMA Superbike Championship (Yamaha)
1992: 1st - National 250cc Championship (Yamaha)
1991: Amateur racing in 600cc, 750cc and 250cc classes

Doesnt look like the chump nugget some are making him out to be .. sure now he is passed by more machines with more $ in them, but he has a decent enough record hand out a few stfu's

[*Oggy*]

Back to basics... Pommes v Yanks....

Who would you trust.....

:beatdeadhorse:

[Dr freedom]

& here is Toselands career:

2007 1st - World Superbike Championship 2006 2nd - World Superbike Championship
2005 4th - World Superbike Championship
2004 1st - World Superbike Championship
2003 3rd - World Superbike Championship
2002 7th - World Superbike Championship
2001 13th - World Superbike Championship
2000 12th - British Superbike Championship
1999 11th - World Supersport Championship
1998 18th - World Supersport Championship
1997 3rd - British Supersport Championship
1st - British Honda CB500 Cup
1996 11th - Superteen Championship
1995 1st - Junior Road Race Championship
1994 125cc Road racing
1992 Inter 100cc Youth Series (Best Newcomer)
1989-1993 Trials

Both of these career stats were taken from an article dated the Oct 2007

[Turtle]

There's no doubt that JT is a awesome rider, but he's the new kid on the block when it comes to Moto Gp.......

[Cedric]

I think another equation into the MotoGP mix is Dorna's constant requirement for increased TV ratings. In order to achieve higher ratings, there is a need to fill the grid with riders of differing nationalities so that fans in their countries can get behind them and watch the races (adding to TV ratings, advertising revenue and so forth). Being the token rider (Alex Hoffmann, Shakey Byrne, Jeremy McWilliams) isn't often a career move when you are on inferior equipment and promoted to the premier class based on nationality and a modicum (compared to the other MotoGP riders) of riding ability alone. Anyway, I'm getting off the point here..

Perhaps Edwards is being kept on by Dorna in order to satisfy the potentially huge US market with Hopkins/Hayden/Edwards, providing a rider for at least someone to get behind. Toseland is by far the most competitive Brit we've seen in quite a while. Good for Dorna and the British/American market to keep both these riders in MotoGP.

Off track.. but my 2 cents as to why Edwards is still here.

[Stu23]

Anyone who is in MotoGP is a stunning rider, whoever they are :)

[Birdman45]

Agreed Stu, 100%, been saying that for a while now, but while some people say "oh well he was still on Michelins and is one of the top 2 or 3 development riders means SFA. In Rossi's team mate year case, he is there to get Rossi to the front, especially considering those years Stoner was so strong and Rossi was struggling. Again, as soon as Rossi mangled it and was out, who was up fronnt all of a sudden? Edwards. Why? coz why waste the best gear on someone injured and not gonna compete. The problem has been, that the difference in A and B tyres may only be .3=.5sec/lap. but in GP, if you don't get a good start and you're trying to get by riders for 5 laps, by the time you get sorted and you're .3sec/lap off, where are you at race end?

On top of that, every rider is different. They all require different "needs" from the bike to get them as fast as they wanna be. Now, obviously for eg, Melandri can ride, been up front for how long on previous biukes? But on a bike that didn't suit him he was where? You see my point? Again, it has nothing to do with US riders for Dorna or whatever, like I said, the tEAMS and RIDERS know who is good, who is doing what on which bike and why etc and for that reason alone, CE is still where he is. Talkin to Hopper one night in Melbourne, he was off his head........... we had to load him into a cab anyway, he was saying that Colin has so much respect in the field coz he is a damn fast fuk given the right equipment. Hence he can qualify well, or test better than most, everything is available, but come race day it ain't, or hasn't been til next year hopefully. He also said after the assen crash he thought his chance was gone. Meaning that they gave him the equipment needed while they could (Rossi had nothin') but now he's back, he ain't gonna get that chance again. What he was saying was pretty full on and spoke more of how everything works than he prolly knew he was talling us at the time. LOL On the Honda he was fukt with Chassis probs and had to embarrass the Honda heirachy at a press release to get the same chassis that 99% of the other Hondas had but that was 3/4 through the year. He was at the front and would/should have won at Qatar on the RCV but team orders made him sit by and see Gibernau take the win. 1st year was Aprilia, who the FUK was ever gonna do anything on that, still didn't do too bad though did he? There's way more to it than just what most people read, see and shoot the shit over. What I hope is that the tyre rule will take some of that away and we can see some more even racing, regardless of who is winning. BUT , and I know it's IFs, but in the scheme of where he was and what should have happened, if you take the qatar win and the assen win (should have been) then he'd have won two races, 2 more than Toseland will ever win I rekon. LOL Time will tell.

[Stu23]

Yup agreed.........If all on the same tyre, including construction etc etc....then it will be better, at least there will be no more room for tyre excuses as it will be the same for everyone.. Those able to make best use of their chassis setup to retain tyre life throughout the race will be at the front next year is what im thinking.....those that cannot set up well will struggle....now is this why Tosleland got a diferent race engineer ?

[gazujc]

1st year was Aprilia, who the FUK was ever gonna do anything on that, still didn't do too bad though did he?


That year he produced some of the best footage seen in MotoGP, that being when the Aprilia tried to BBQ him and he exited stage right at a fair rate of knots to save himself.

As for the tires, if they even things up to the degree hoped by most than I will happily admit that I am wrong but I suspect that the tires will remain suited to the current crop of top riders leaving the others to struggle. IMO, a better indication would be 2010 when all teams/factories would have had 12 months of data etc with which to finetune the bike/tire combination.

IMO (yet again), there is a real risk that the tire situation will impede a riders chance at the title in 2009 as they will give up to many points in the first few races becoming familiar with the tires.

You may well be right with regards to CE and I for one will not question whether he deserved an opportunity (IMO, he should have had the chance earlier), nor will I question that he is regarded by all as a top bloke (all officials I know who worked WSBK/MotoGP in the tower and elsewheer love him).

FWIW, I hope he does perfrom as I do Hopkins, Vermuelen etc and that we have a year not seen for a long time where we have battles galore and through the field. If it happens I will happily own up and say I was wrong bigtime (if CE wins a race I will be the first to buy you a beer - take that down), but I suspect that 2009 will be much the same as 2008.



And Stu23, absolutely correct with your comment about how damn good these guys are as they could beat the vast majority of us with one had toed behind their back riding a scooter.


As for the Dorna thing though, I do not think that CE got or has retained his place because of any drive into the US market as I suspect that is more the realm of Hayden/Hopkins and in 2010 Spies.





Garry