First attempt at Bike Painting

[Schtevo]

Well I have never painted a bike (or anything else) before but after my recent CBR600 purchase I decided it was time to have a go since having it done by a professional painter was beyond my budget.

The bike was cosmetically pretty terrible when I brought it as anyone who saw it at EC on Anzac day will confirm - a lot of road rash up the RHS, paint cracking and peeling elsewhere and the glass in generally poor condition.

Now keep in mind here that I have limited time to work on this project due to weekend commitments and that I have commited to ride at OP on 9th June, I'm working in stages so the bike can be put back together at almost any stage.

Shopping List:
Air compressor - I already had a small 2.5HP one
Spray Gun - HVLP Gravity fed touchup gun $35 on EBay (PM if you want the seller details, good operator)
Paint, Thinner, Primer, wet and dry paper and the like - $275 (enough for the FZR as well)
Decals - $45 (per bike) on EBay (Again, great seller if you want his details)
Fibreglass Repair Stuff - $30
Epoxy Body Filler - $20

I didn't take any before shots - it really was that ugly...

Here is the work to date:

Tail piece is finished except it just needs final buffing but will not do that until clear coat has had a week to fully harden - and probably will wait until whole bike is done.

Front Mudguard - as for tail piece

Tank - Just painted the colour - straight off the gun so it looks dull - needs to be buffed, decals applied and clear coat applied

Belly Pan - as for the tank. The belly pan was a major work in repairing - the bike had been down on the RHS and there was many cracks.

The Upper Fairing is the biggest work and I have not yet decided if I am going to start it prior to OP on the 9th. As you can see there is much filling and sanding required....

I'm pretty happy with the results so far - if all goes well I'll have both track bikes looking pretty reasonable for under $500 total.

[jasonbw]

Well done mate! I'm just doing the same, got a hint that getting a really good spray gun helps lots with the quality (i.e. dont skimp). Great to see mate, well done!

[muzz]

that looks good mate
as for your tank ,you dont need to buff it before putting the stickers on
at the most give the whole thing a light sand with 1200 /1500 before clear coating

[muzz]

what sort of paint are you using?
those cheap guns arnt to bad either

[Schtevo]

that looks good mate
as for your tank ,you dont need to buff it before putting the stickers on
at the most give the whole thing a light sand with 1200 /1500 before clear coating

what sort of paint are you using?
those cheap guns arnt to bad either




Thanks for the tip

I'm using Enamel, can't recall the brand but I got it from a dedicated automotive paint supplier so it's the right stuff. I decided against using 2 Pack because of the mixing requirements.

The gun seems to be good so far, easy to use and clean so I see no problem with it. It is only designed for touch ups though and would be way too small to do a car

[jasonbw]

Any tips from a spray painter on what gun to buy? or should I hire one to get a better quality?

[muzz]

hahaha how much do you want to spend? they can start at around fiddy bucks and go to 1k and above if you want

if your only going to dabble then get a cheapie from super cheap or bunnings
(the bunnings ones are not a bad gun really)

if you want somthing that will last then IWATA,SATA ,or DEVILBIS are the go
ive owned all of these and prefer the SATA JET
these you are looking at around 400-600 skins

[muzz]

ohh yeah
good compressor is a must
the gun specs should have a min cfm rating ,you can get away with a smaller one doing bikes and small stuff but cars you want a lot bigger capacity
i wouldnt buy one any smaller than around 13 cfm because guns and air tools suck a heap of air when you using them all the time and theres nothing worse than have to stop half way across a bonnet to wait for your pressure to build up again.
muzz

[Schtevo]

This is the one I am using, like I said way to small for a car but seems to be ok for what I'm doing

http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=380022407075

From what I have been told most of the effort in a project like this should be in the prep work, that's where I have been concentrating and it seems to be paying off so far.

My compressor is not that big, but then I'm not painting car bonnets either. It's just one of those little super cheap autos compressors - it seems to be keeping up so far as I have not had to stop and wait for it at any time.

[muzz]

thats good
a small gun dosnt require the same as a big one
i have a twin cyinder compressor but it can only just keep up with the gun and with a air orbital sander dont even bother trying
i sold all my painting gear before i moved here from unn zudd and are slowly getting it all back ..........slowly

[Schtevo]

thats good
a small gun dosnt require the same as a big one
i have a twin cyinder compressor but it can only just keep up with the gun and with a air orbital sander dont even bother trying
i sold all my painting gear before i moved here from unn zudd and are slowly getting it all back ..........slowly


Have not even attempted to use an air tool on my little compressor - think I would be wasting my time. Even worse that could lead to me wanting a larger compressor and the brakes have been applied externally to my spending on all things bike related....

[muzz]

doh

[Mozzie]

Any tips from a spray painter on what gun to buy? or should I hire one to get a better quality?

Any Gravity gun, the cheap ones on ebay will do the job well. HVLP (high volume low pressure) guns are designed for low air output, meaning less overspray which neans less waste, BUT it does not atomise the paint as good as a normal spray gun which can lead to larger orange peel to cut back. Unless you turn the air up which defeats the purpose of the gun,so take your pick but I prefer the norm. Needle & tip size for topcoat and some undercoat with gravity gun 1.4mm. High build undercoat 2.0mm

[BART]

Great Job :ayyy: I do not have the skill or motivation to do this sort of thing.

I also just painted my CBR600 but painting & I just don't mix. I am over it before I started.

I bought some enamel for $30 and whacked it on with a spray gun. f**k rubbing back, I keep telling myself ........it's only a track bike.

I look at the job Hayden did with his ZX10 with a spray can and hang my head in shame.

Love your work :)

My crappy work

The best part is the RATS stickers

http://img389.imageshack.us/img389/3264/img1048rm3.jpg

[triumph]

that looks alright bart . :ayyy:

[BART]

Wait until you get close :mad:

[Falco]

Matt Black hides everything.

[BART]

Blue goes faster.............. Hayden did a 1.42 and it was all to do with the colour....... I hope :)

[Schtevo]

An important lesson learned last night - go easy when rubbing back.

I was rubbing back the tank prior after spraying the colour and there was an area that had a bit more overspray than the rest - gave it a good rub and went straight through the colour and into the primer - Bugger!

Too annoyed with myself to take a photo last night, but at least I'm learning I guess.

Obviously it needed another coat of colour anyway.

[jasonbw]

Keep the hints coming :ayyy:

Its not in a spot where a decal will go is it ?? :D

[Schtevo]

Keep the hints coming :ayyy:

Its not in a spot where a decal will go is it ?? :D

No way would I be that lucky....

[muzz]

Any Gravity gun, the cheap ones on ebay will do the job well. HVLP (high volume low pressure) guns are designed for low air output, meaning less overspray which neans less waste, BUT it does not atomise the paint as good as a normal spray gun which can lead to larger orange peel to cut back. Unless you turn the air up which defeats the purpose of the gun,so take your pick but I prefer the norm. Needle & tip size for topcoat and some undercoat with gravity gun 1.4mm. High build undercoat 2.0mm

hvlp guns are good but its a hard switch to make
the biggest thing with a hvlp is volume of air to the gun not pressure
which when using hvlp air lines and supply need to be up graded
its a bit like a fuel system ,its on use putting say half inch lines on a race car and only have when the feed is smaller ,the lines are only going to flow as much as the smallest part of the system soooooooo...
for hvlp to work as it supposed too it needs bigger air lines with no restrictions anywhere

[Mozzie]

hvlp guns are good but its a hard switch to make
the biggest thing with a hvlp is volume of air to the gun not pressure
which when using hvlp air lines and supply need to be up graded
its a bit like a fuel system ,its on use putting say half inch lines on a race car and only have when the feed is smaller ,the lines are only going to flow as much as the smallest part of the system soooooooo...
for hvlp to work as it supposed too it needs bigger air lines with no restrictions anywhere

spot on.

[Chaser]

A 1.4mm set up is good. I'd try 2 pack as it is sooo easy to spray. Enamel actually can take 2-3 weeks to properly harden. 2-3 coats of 2 pack and then clear straight over the top. You should be able to gloss it straight off the gun. Make sure you wear a mask with enamel - it's like chewing gum - sticks to everything!

[Schtevo]

Managed to sneak out of work a bit early today to get a bit done on the bike.

I resprayed the red on the tank that I rubbed through the other day and applied the decals to the belly pan.

I finish work at lunchtime on Fridays (I love my job) so will try to get the decals applied to the tank and the clear done on both tank and belly pan tomorrow.

Tips on Decals:
Be very careful with orientation - I had one of the pictured Honda Decals taped in a carefully measured position upside down (well look at the first pic - the decal was right way up on the upside down belly pan) and was about to remove the backing and then I realised.....
Measure carefully - they are permanent once applied

[Mozzie]

It"s gunna look great when you finish mate, It"s amazing what a coat of paint does. Good on ya for doing your self.:ayyy:

[lilninja]

When rubbing back make sure you use a rubber block and 1200 grade wet and dry, make sure you use plenty of water to get it as smooth as posible,

Jase I have a cheap spray gun that you can borrow if you want, it came with my Air compressor which is small output so it should work fairly well.

[jasonbw]

Thanks mate, good to see you back, I'll turn down the offer just because I've heard from Al and Kellz that a good quality gun is a must. I might check out whats for hire at go hire :D

[Schtevo]

HELP!

I just finished the clear coat on the belly pan and tank and right at the end of the last coat it all went wrong. For some reason the nice shiny red started going milky - almost pink in places.

It was the one batch of clear, nothing (that I can tell) changed halfway through.

Can any of the experts out there tell me what might have caused this - and will it buff out or will I have to sand it off and start again (hope not, will need to buy another set of decals)

[muzz]

its bloomed
mainly caused by being to cold
it can be buffed out mate dont panic

[Schtevo]

its bloomed
mainly caused by being to cold
it can be buffed out mate dont panic

Cheers mate - was pretty p!ssed at myself there thinking I'd stuffed it up.

Will takes some pics in better light before buffing to show everyone what this looks like, seems there are a few RATs out there following my project to learn from my mistakes.

[muzz]

are you going to wet rub it with 1200 again before buffing?

[Schtevo]

are you going to wet rub it with 1200 again before buffing?

You're the expert here, I should be asking the questions... I was planning on just going striaght for the buffing compound but if you think I'll get a better result with wet 1200 first I'll go that way

[muzz]

im still unsure of what paint you are using you said enamel but sounds to me you are using lacquer
anyway it all depends on how much clear you have on your job
i would have at least 2 medium wet coats and 3 maybe more full wet coats of clear on there
if you have heaps on there then yeah 1200 wet it down ,get rid of any orange peel and crap you have stuck in it
then buff it i like using a finer type compound ,trick is take it easy and slow
let the buff do the work

[muzz]

its a bit hard trying to teach somone to do this sort of thing oner a forum
if you were closer i could come a show you my self

[jasonbw]

There were a few references to gun types and nozzle sizes here, can we get a couple of opinions specifically to these?

HPLV doesnt seem suitable for us with cheap arse compressors at home, thin air line etc, so I guess its the standard type we should use, is that right?
there are a coulple of nozzle sizes mentioned in regards to undercoat and top coat + a diff size for the colour itself... was that right, and is that the same sizes you use in HPLV v's standard?

Seemingly, when colour matching you need to get a specific undercoat, my painting will be the typical Honda Red (winning red), any hints on the following:

What sandpaper grade pre primer coat?
Do I buy the primer/filler stuff and spray it on or should I use a spray can?
What undercoat should I use (brand?)
What brand paint?
What top coat?

Now to the next hard part, what type of paint to choose?

I've got words floating around like enamel, acrylic, two pack, laquer, none of which I know anything about except for typical household painting knowledge... Whats best for someone who doesnt mind paying extra for a good finish... (theres a type that was suggested to me once, two pack? where you dont sand between coats, but its dearer and ends up nicer?? is that right?)

Sorry for all the questions, guess I've just compressed all my questions into one post.

[muzz]

auto barn has a fairly good selection of primers and stuff , not sure if they tint colors there tho
two pack really is the way to go, you get gloss off the gun and its durable as
fuck
you can go either single layer which is basicly spray the base colour and thats it
or two layer ,different base coat with a two pack clear for the shine
both are fairly good but at least with the two layer you can stop sand out any crap you may get along the way before clearing it
i would use two pack pimer as well but you can get away with single pack
if you wanna save a few bucks
basicly primer can be used as a filler or a surfacer depnding on how much you thin it , two pack primer also fills a whole lot better
auto barn has both two pack and single pack primers as well

[jasonbw]

Looks like they do tint too..

For fairings (these are OEM ones), should I be looking at plastic primers, ones that are more flexible?

Thanks for the info, just re-reading your post now and using that to guide me through google searches.

[muzz]

nup you wont need plastic primers mate

[jasonbw]

Good stuff !

Got some other basics from this (http://homepage.eircom.net/~hondabros/SPRAY_PAINTING_TIPS.html) page...the long road starts... hey Steve, how'd you go getting that milkyness out of your coat?

EDIT: Fixed the link above.

[jasonbw]

Any thoughts on this setup guys?
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/1-x-1-5mm-Touch-Up-1-x-2mm-Suction-Spray-Gun-in-Case_W0QQitemZ200231917751QQihZ010QQcategoryZ34999 QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

[Chaser]

Gravity fed guns are better (that's where the pot sits above the actual gun). You don't waste any paint at all as it all goes through the gun. A 2mm set up is pretty big and a 1.4mm set up would be better. The touch up gun would be a little small to paint an entire bike with.

[jasonbw]

For the gravity setup though (Hi press, low volume) don't I need a more kick arse compressor setup that my cheap bunnings style one??

[kellz]

i used a gravity feed 1.4mm with a 2.5 hp compressor.. ( $120 bucks for teh compressor)

the main thing you need to be aware of is the refile time and the average working pressure.

i think i worked at about 6-8 bar most of the time and with doing bike parts you are on and off the gun alot so teh tank shouldnt completely empty and should be able to keep up with you.

a quick re-fill time can be helpfull if your doing large areas but not necessary for bike parts as the longest i was on one piece/ section was only 10-15 seconds per spray wave..

[Schtevo]

Good stuff !

Got some other basics from this (http://homepage.eircom.net/~hondabros/SPRAY_PAINTING_TIPS.html) page...the long road starts... hey Steve, how'd you go getting that milkyness out of your coat?

EDIT: Fixed the link above.

It buffed out really quickly as it was only in the last coat anyway. The project has been slightly shelved due to the contstant poor weather - as soon as I get a weekend where it isn't raining I'll be back into it.

[kellz]

the milkyness would of been from being to cold

glad its buffed out

[jasonbw]

Time to resume the thread, question for you spray painting buffs (good pun eh)...

I'm using hichem (http://www.hichem.com.au/hicheminfo/PIDS/PIDS.html) acrylic primer, then acrylic colour, then I'll be using the two pack iso free... I've done the colour, do I sand at all now before doing the clear? Normally with the Information sheets they tell you what grade to sand between the primer and colour, but nothing on the sheet dealing with after doing the colour but before the clear.

???

[Mozzie]

I read the data sheets and no you do not sand. Spray the 2k cear staight on after 24hrs. The colour is a base coat which has no hardener in it, so a 2k clear is needed for the shine and hardness. Dust is your enemy. Happy painting.

[jasonbw]

Thanks Mozzie :)Typical, today is windy !!!

[kellz]

yeh wipe down with prepsol inbetween every coat..
this will help.
then id do 3-4 clear coats to allow for a good sanding and hardness

[muzz]

ummm i wouldnt go wiping fresh base coat with prepsol end up wiping the base coat off
as for clear you only need it to dry off befor clear 1/2 hour tops ,if you leave it to long the clear can peel

[Turtle]

Looks pretty Damn good to me matee............:ayyy: